fsj-digest Thursday, June 10 2004 Volume 01 : Number 2167 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: fsj: Re: rock ramp fsj: Re: rock ramp fsj: say it ain't so... fsj: Re: say it ain't so... fsj: shocks Re: fsj: shocks fsj: shocks Re: fsj: shocks fsj: Re: shocks fsj: 360 to 401 Conversion Re: fsj: 360 to 401 Conversion RE: fsj: 360 to 401 Conversion fsj: Anyone need a 360? fsj: J truck tailgate on EBay (not mine) Re: fsj: 360 to 401 Conversion fsj: Re: Kia M715 copy FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 9 Jun 2004 13:40:29 -0700 From: "Jim Blair" Subject: fsj: Re: rock ramp It does look like you had fun. I had a pile up to the top of my J4000's hood dumped on it (by an inattentive dumptruck driver), and I just drove forward through the pile. I scattered it pretty good too (I was on my way to Red Cross training and that almost made me too late to get in!) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Jun 2004 20:15:35 -0400 From: "Neal Hoover" Subject: fsj: Re: rock ramp lol! i did the same thing with my XJ when i had about 12-tons delivered for my driveway. tooooo tempting to not slap her in 4-low and have at it. my wife just laughs at me. :) Neal A. Hoover Project '76 J-10 Project '96 XJ - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dan Black" To: "Full Size Jeeps" Sent: Wednesday, June 09, 2004 1:43 PM Subject: fsj: rock ramp >> Fun with a pile o' gravel: >> >> http://129.186.79.84/pics/74Wag%20rockramp/ >> >> -------------------------------------------------------------------------- - ----- >> I have a theory that all traffic lights are secretly synchronized -- >> you just have to drive fast enough. Testing this theory has lead me to >> develop a second theory: Most police officers are NOT men of science. >> >> -- Paul Wiley >> -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Jun 2004 21:43:12 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: fsj: say it ain't so... :) Paris Goes After SUVs PARIS (Reuters) - Bulky four-by-fours could be banned from clogging up the chic streets of Paris after a top official in the capital's left-wing government described them as a polluting "caricature of a car" unsuited to city life. An anti-sports utility vehicle (SUV) resolution passed by the city council could lead to a ban on the popular vehicles in about 18 months if it is included in an overall project to improve traffic flow in the city, Deputy Mayor Denis Baupin said Wednesday. "You have to wonder why people want to drive around in SUVs," Baupin, a Greens party member, said on Europe 1 radio. "We have no interest in having SUVs in the city. They're dangerous to others and take up too much space." The city council voted Tuesday to urge Socialist Mayor Bertrand Delanoe to consider banning SUVs, which have become popular in recent years and now make up about five percent of the French car market -- just below the western Europe average. Baupin said Paris, which has been setting aside more lanes for buses and bicycles since a Socialist and Greens coalition took over City Hall in 2001, could not legally ban SUVs outright. "Our idea is to limit the circulation of the most polluting vehicles," he said. "That means SUVs and lots of other vehicles that don't meet European pollution standards." Baupin, who often cycles around Paris to promote more environmentally friendly transport, called SUVs a caricature of a car and said they were not adapted for use in a city. "It's made for a family on vacation ... and usually they only have one person in them," he said. "Let's be logical and only allow into the city cars that are adapted to it." ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2004 07:56:27 -0400 From: "Neal Hoover" Subject: fsj: Re: say it ain't so... don't get me started on the french.... Neal A. Hoover Project '76 J-10 Project '96 XJ - ----- Original Message ----- From: "john" To: Sent: Thursday, June 10, 2004 12:43 AM Subject: fsj: say it ain't so... >> :) >> >> >> Paris Goes After SUVs >> >> >> PARIS (Reuters) - Bulky four-by-fours could be banned from clogging up the chic streets of Paris after a top official in the capital's left-wing government described them as a polluting "caricature of a car" unsuited to city life. >> >> An anti-sports utility vehicle (SUV) resolution passed by the city council could lead to a ban on the popular vehicles in about 18 months if it is included in an overall project to improve traffic flow in the city, Deputy Mayor Denis Baupin said Wednesday. >> >> "You have to wonder why people want to drive around in SUVs," Baupin, a Greens party member, said on Europe 1 radio. >> >> "We have no interest in having SUVs in the city. They're dangerous to others and take up too much space." >> >> The city council voted Tuesday to urge Socialist Mayor Bertrand Delanoe to consider banning SUVs, which have become popular in recent years and now make up about five percent of the French car market -- just below the western Europe average. >> >> Baupin said Paris, which has been setting aside more lanes for buses and bicycles since a Socialist and Greens coalition took over City Hall in 2001, could not legally ban SUVs outright. >> >> "Our idea is to limit the circulation of the most polluting vehicles," he said. "That means SUVs and lots of other vehicles that don't meet European pollution standards." >> >> Baupin, who often cycles around Paris to promote more environmentally friendly transport, called SUVs a caricature of a car and said they were not adapted for use in a city. >> >> "It's made for a family on vacation ... and usually they only have one person in them," he said. >> >> "Let's be logical and only allow into the city cars that are adapted to it." >> >> ---- >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** >> Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2004 08:40:08 -0400 From: "Neal Hoover" Subject: fsj: shocks ok, pardon the mundane question about shocks, but i need to pick up a set for my j-truck. long story short, the truck came to me with a pretty stiff 4"-6" lift on it already, and i plan to keep it for the time being. so, that means i'm looking for about the softest shock i can get so i don't make the ride any firmer than it already is. any suggestions on what shock to get that is the softest? Rancho 5000? Pro-Comp ES3000? BDS? others? (btw, i'm also looking for about the cheapest way out, too ;) Neal A. Hoover Project '76 J-10 Project '96 XJ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2004 06:44:33 -0700 From: john meister Subject: Re: fsj: shocks rancho 5000s have worked for me on most FSJs... they have a sale every year... might consider used ones if you can find them on ebay or in a yard... haven't kept up to date on shocks... oh, if you get the 9000s you can adjust them... john Neal Hoover wrote: >> ok, pardon the mundane question about shocks, but i need to pick up a set >> for my j-truck. long story short, the truck came to me with a pretty stiff >> 4"-6" lift on it already, and i plan to keep it for the time being. so, >> that means i'm looking for about the softest shock i can get so i don't make >> the ride any firmer than it already is. >> any suggestions on what shock to get that is the softest? >> Rancho 5000? >> Pro-Comp ES3000? >> BDS? >> others? >> >> (btw, i'm also looking for about the cheapest way out, too ;) >> >> Neal A. Hoover >> Project '76 J-10 >> Project '96 XJ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2004 08:45:52 CDT From: Dan Black Subject: fsj: shocks Here's what a friend of mine said. He knows his stuff, including Jeeps (and FSJs), and suspension. I asked him about the Rancho RSXs, which I want to get for my '88, but I had to go with 5000s for the '74 since the RSX isn't available for a couple years including '74 (and yes, the mounting is actually different). And he has the RSXes on a '95 GChero, and I'm pretty sure has had 5000s on his F150 and stuff. Sounds like the 5000s would be good, especially if you want cheaper (while maintaining quality), because RSX are more expensive anyway. IIRC, the RSXes were around $52 each, while the 5000s were $28 or so. (Check summitracing.com and jegs.com .) =============================================================================== Yeah, the RSX's are probably okay, the 5000s I always felt were a bit stiff, BUT if he's working with a high rate spring, low rate shocks are just going to cause it to bounce all over the place and make the ride worse rather than better ... On Jun 10, 2004, at 7:58 AM, Dan Black wrote: >> Any suggestions? Perhaps the RSX, if he can get them for that >> application with the lift? >> >> ======================================================================= >> ======== >> To: >> From: "Neal Hoover" >> Subject: fsj: shocks >> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2004 08:40:08 -0400 >> >> ok, pardon the mundane question about shocks, but i need to pick up a >> set >> for my j-truck. long story short, the truck came to me with a pretty >> stiff >> 4"-6" lift on it already, and i plan to keep it for the time being. >> so, >> that means i'm looking for about the softest shock i can get so i >> don't make >> the ride any firmer than it already is. >> any suggestions on what shock to get that is the softest? >> Rancho 5000? >> Pro-Comp ES3000? >> BDS? >> others? >> >> (btw, i'm also looking for about the cheapest way out, too ;) >> >> Neal A. Hoover >> Project '76 J-10 >> Project '96 XJ =============================================================================== - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- When I am working on a problem I never think about beauty. I only think about how to solve the problem. But when I have finished, if the solution is not beautiful, I know it is wrong. -- Buckminster Fuller - -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2004 10:49:21 -0400 From: "Neal Hoover" Subject: Re: fsj: shocks thanks. adjustability may be nice, but too pricey.... :) Neal A. Hoover Project '76 J-10 Project '96 XJ - ----- Original Message ----- From: "john meister" To: "Neal Hoover" Cc: Sent: Thursday, June 10, 2004 9:44 AM Subject: Re: fsj: shocks >> rancho 5000s have worked for me on most FSJs... they have a sale every >> year... might consider used ones if you can find them on ebay or in >> a yard... haven't kept up to date on shocks... oh, if you get >> the 9000s you can adjust them... >> >> john >> >> Neal Hoover wrote: > >>> > ok, pardon the mundane question about shocks, but i need to pick up a set >>> > for my j-truck. long story short, the truck came to me with a pretty stiff >>> > 4"-6" lift on it already, and i plan to keep it for the time being. so, >>> > that means i'm looking for about the softest shock i can get so i don't make >>> > the ride any firmer than it already is. >>> > any suggestions on what shock to get that is the softest? >>> > Rancho 5000? >>> > Pro-Comp ES3000? >>> > BDS? >>> > others? >>> > >>> > (btw, i'm also looking for about the cheapest way out, too ;) >>> > >>> > Neal A. Hoover >>> > Project '76 J-10 >>> > Project '96 XJ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2004 10:50:52 -0400 From: "Neal Hoover" Subject: fsj: Re: shocks thanks, Dan! Neal A. Hoover Project '76 J-10 Project '96 XJ - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dan Black" To: "Full Size Jeeps" Sent: Thursday, June 10, 2004 9:45 AM Subject: fsj: shocks >> Here's what a friend of mine said. He knows his stuff, including Jeeps >> (and FSJs), and suspension. >> >> I asked him about the Rancho RSXs, which I want to get for my '88, but I >> had to go with 5000s for the '74 since the RSX isn't available for a >> couple years including '74 (and yes, the mounting is actually >> different). And he has the RSXes on a '95 GChero, and I'm pretty sure >> has had 5000s on his F150 and stuff. >> >> Sounds like the 5000s would be good, especially if you want cheaper >> (while maintaining quality), because RSX are more expensive anyway. >> IIRC, the RSXes were around $52 each, while the 5000s were $28 or so. >> (Check summitracing.com and jegs.com .) >> >> ============================================================================ === >> >> Yeah, the RSX's are probably okay, the 5000s I always felt were a bit >> stiff, BUT if he's working with a high rate spring, low rate shocks are >> just going to cause it to bounce all over the place and make the ride >> worse rather than better ... >> >> On Jun 10, 2004, at 7:58 AM, Dan Black wrote: >> > >>> > Any suggestions? Perhaps the RSX, if he can get them for that >>> > application with the lift? >>> > >>> > ======================================================================= >>> > ======== >>> > To: >>> > From: "Neal Hoover" >>> > Subject: fsj: shocks >>> > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2004 08:40:08 -0400 >>> > >>> > ok, pardon the mundane question about shocks, but i need to pick up a >>> > set >>> > for my j-truck. long story short, the truck came to me with a pretty >>> > stiff >>> > 4"-6" lift on it already, and i plan to keep it for the time being. >>> > so, >>> > that means i'm looking for about the softest shock i can get so i >>> > don't make >>> > the ride any firmer than it already is. >>> > any suggestions on what shock to get that is the softest? >>> > Rancho 5000? >>> > Pro-Comp ES3000? >>> > BDS? >>> > others? >>> > >>> > (btw, i'm also looking for about the cheapest way out, too ;) >>> > >>> > Neal A. Hoover >>> > Project '76 J-10 >>> > Project '96 XJ > >> >> ============================================================================ === >> >> -------------------------------------------------------------------------- - ----- >> When I am working on a problem I never think about beauty. I only think >> about how to solve the problem. But when I have finished, if the solution >> is not beautiful, I know it is wrong. >> -- Buckminster Fuller >> -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2004 07:53:45 -0700 From: "Dalan Hawker" Subject: fsj: 360 to 401 Conversion I am about to rebuild my 360 for my 87 Grandwagoneer and I was thinking, why not replace it with a 401. How big of a job is this and can I get a core from somewhere when I only have a 360 for swap? I was told the flexplate needed to be replaced, anything else or does it just bolt right in? Is there a down side to this conversion? I will be pulling a travel trailer with the rig so was hoping to have as much lowend power as possible. Dalan ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2004 10:33:32 CDT From: Dan Black Subject: Re: fsj: 360 to 401 Conversion "Dalan Hawker" said: {- I am about to rebuild my 360 for my 87 Grandwagoneer and I was thinking, {- why not replace it with a 401. How big of a job is this and can I get a {- core from somewhere when I only have a 360 for swap? I was told the {- flexplate needed to be replaced, anything else or does it just bolt {- right in? Is there a down side to this conversion? I will be pulling a {- travel trailer with the rig so was hoping to have as much lowend power {- as possible. Also consider lower gears if you want more low-end power and torque for pulling trailers and stuff. Will hurt your top speed, and might get worse mileage on the highway, but I think it actually helps my mileage in town, since I get _tons_ of red lights, and it sure makes taking off and low-rpm gruntwork easier. My '74 has both a 401 and low gears (we're guessing 4.09s, but haven't checked -- 3.09 was stock, but pretty sure they're lower than that), and I had a good ol' time last weekend pulling a trailer with a ton (literally) of rock and then another trailer with a half-ton (that's a guess) trenching machine on it. Didn't take off as fast as usual, obviously, but definitely had plenty of power to pull the stuff. As for your actual question, I put a 401 in my '88 last year (since the 360 was ruined). I paid just under $2000 _total_ for the remanufactured 401 (0.060" over, unfortunately, but that's what my '74 is now, too), including core charge and shipping, and I didn't have a good core to give them. (Most places require one.) They don't have it on their list anymore, but the page is still there; give them a call and see if they still have any if you're interested: http://tinyurl.com/3csb5 ( http://www.rebuilt-auto-engines.com/cgi-bin/webc.cgi/st_prod.html?p_vid=24871&p_partnum=AMC-401LB&sid=1AlF2z0moMM4CkN-05103343601.cb ) S&S Engine Remanufacturing 1023 N. Monroe Spokane, WA 99201 (800) 942-7800 (509) 325-4558 I'm assuming you have the stock TF727 transmission, as I did on the '88. For that, as you mentioned, you'll need a new flexplate. Just ask for one from a '73 Javelin or Ambassador; those had a 401 with a TF727. I paid I think around $42 for one brand new; if you can't find one for that price, email me, and I'll see what I can find. (Though then you'll also have to pay shipping.) I also had to get a different harmonic balancer, which I got brand new for $130.72 from Damper Dudes in California. (Remanufactured was $77.72 plus a $45 core charge, so it wasn't much more to get brand new, which had no core charge.) Here's their info: Damper Dudes 6180 Parallel Rd Anderson, CA 96007 (800) 413-2673 (530) 244-7225 Last, I think they had to put a different starter on, and maybe a new voltage regulator to go with it, though I don't remember details. I can ask the mechanic if you want. So yes, there is more than just the flexplate, and it adds up a little bit, but overall, it's not too bad. (Hey, John, wanna toss this into a web page on wagoneers.com for a frequently asked question?) - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- To most people solutions mean finding the answers. But to chemists, solutions are things that are still all mixed up. - -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2004 08:50:27 -0700 From: "Dalan Hawker" Subject: RE: fsj: 360 to 401 Conversion Thanks Dan, that is good information and will help me make an informed decision on this swap. - -----Original Message----- From: Dan Black [mailto:dan-at-black.org] Sent: June 10, 2004 8:34 AM To: Full Size Jeeps Subject: Re: fsj: 360 to 401 Conversion "Dalan Hawker" said: {- I am about to rebuild my 360 for my 87 Grandwagoneer and I was thinking, {- why not replace it with a 401. How big of a job is this and can I get a {- core from somewhere when I only have a 360 for swap? I was told the {- flexplate needed to be replaced, anything else or does it just bolt {- right in? Is there a down side to this conversion? I will be pulling a {- travel trailer with the rig so was hoping to have as much lowend power {- as possible. Also consider lower gears if you want more low-end power and torque for pulling trailers and stuff. Will hurt your top speed, and might get worse mileage on the highway, but I think it actually helps my mileage in town, since I get _tons_ of red lights, and it sure makes taking off and low-rpm gruntwork easier. My '74 has both a 401 and low gears (we're guessing 4.09s, but haven't checked -- 3.09 was stock, but pretty sure they're lower than that), and I had a good ol' time last weekend pulling a trailer with a ton (literally) of rock and then another trailer with a half-ton (that's a guess) trenching machine on it. Didn't take off as fast as usual, obviously, but definitely had plenty of power to pull the stuff. As for your actual question, I put a 401 in my '88 last year (since the 360 was ruined). I paid just under $2000 _total_ for the remanufactured 401 (0.060" over, unfortunately, but that's what my '74 is now, too), including core charge and shipping, and I didn't have a good core to give them. (Most places require one.) They don't have it on their list anymore, but the page is still there; give them a call and see if they still have any if you're interested: http://tinyurl.com/3csb5 ( http://www.rebuilt-auto-engines.com/cgi-bin/webc.cgi/st_prod.html?p_vid=24871 &p_partnum=AMC-401LB&sid=1AlF2z0moMM4CkN-05103343601.cb ) S&S Engine Remanufacturing 1023 N. Monroe Spokane, WA 99201 (800) 942-7800 (509) 325-4558 I'm assuming you have the stock TF727 transmission, as I did on the '88. For that, as you mentioned, you'll need a new flexplate. Just ask for one from a '73 Javelin or Ambassador; those had a 401 with a TF727. I paid I think around $42 for one brand new; if you can't find one for that price, email me, and I'll see what I can find. (Though then you'll also have to pay shipping.) I also had to get a different harmonic balancer, which I got brand new for $130.72 from Damper Dudes in California. (Remanufactured was $77.72 plus a $45 core charge, so it wasn't much more to get brand new, which had no core charge.) Here's their info: Damper Dudes 6180 Parallel Rd Anderson, CA 96007 (800) 413-2673 (530) 244-7225 Last, I think they had to put a different starter on, and maybe a new voltage regulator to go with it, though I don't remember details. I can ask the mechanic if you want. So yes, there is more than just the flexplate, and it adds up a little bit, but overall, it's not too bad. (Hey, John, wanna toss this into a web page on wagoneers.com for a frequently asked question?) - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- To most people solutions mean finding the answers. But to chemists, solutions are things that are still all mixed up. - -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org - -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2004 10:48:45 -0700 From: "Jim Blair" Subject: fsj: Anyone need a 360? I have one that is supposed to be a good runner, but I haven't run it myself since the intake is off and it has no dist. First $50 for whoever wants it (If you're getting a rebuilt from Global Engines or anyone close to Seattle, I can drop it off for core) I just need to sell it soon before it goes bad sitting outside. (I also have another 360 and a 304 bottom end for core) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2004 10:38:50 -0700 From: "Jim Blair" Subject: fsj: J truck tailgate on EBay (not mine) http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7904793446 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2004 10:50:50 -0700 From: "Jim Blair" Subject: Re: fsj: 360 to 401 Conversion One other point to make: Test fit the converter from the 727 into the back of the 401 to make sure it doesn't have a TH400 pilot bushing! (otherwisw you will total the 727 when you put it together) Speaking of, I have a converter for a 6 cyl 727 here still! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2004 10:53:26 -0700 From: "Jim Blair" Subject: fsj: Re: Kia M715 copy A: If I can find one for sale, I may be able to figure all that out! Jeff wrote: I have always wondered what the process would be to get one of kia's military rigs shipped to the US. I remember the post about them many months ago, and just love their answer to the m715. How cool would it be to go crusing down the road in one of those!? Seriously, could someone get one of those imported? - --- Jim Blair wrote: >> I was looking for some pics and possibly where I >> could get one and I found >> some links. >> http://www.usedtire.co.kr/engine.files/engineMain1-2.html >> (anyone read/speak >> Korean?) >> >> http://globalsecurity.org/military/world/rok/kia.htm >> (This was the first >> link I had which was mirrored from an OZ website.) ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #2167 **************************